Daniel Wayne Smith, is it “A Question of Murder” as revealed Dr. Cyril Wecht and Dawna Kaufmann!
Posted by Rose in All Things Anna Nicole Smith, Anna Nicole Smith, Anna Nicole's Nannies, CBS-ET, Celebrity Trials, Daniel Smith, Daniel Smith's Inquest, Dannielynn, Debra Opri, Debunking the myths on ALL cases related to Anna Nicole, Dr. Kapoor, Dr. Sandeep Kapoor, Entertainment Tonight, Exclusive Rose Speaks, Ford Shelley, G Ben Thompson, Geraldo At Large, Greta -On The Record, Greta Van Susteren, High Proflie Trials, Howard K Stern, Jack Harding, Jackie Hatten, Larry Birkhead, Nancy Grace, Rita Cosby, Virgie Arthur, Wayne Munroe
In “A Question of Murder,” the true crime book that gives an insider view of the death investigations of Daniel Smith, his mother Anna Nicole Smith, and others, famed forensic pathologist and lawyer Dr. Cyril H. Wecht, and his coauthor Dawna Kaufmann, reveals facts never disclosed before.
The following is a brief summary of Wecht’s take on the case — but you’ll want to get a copy of the book and savor it yourself.
In September 2006, Howard K. Stern and Michael Scott, at that time Anna Nicole Smith’s lawyer, placed a conference call to Dr. Wecht, asking him to perform a second autopsy on Daniel Smith. Wecht agreed, as long as it was understood that he would report his findings to them—even if they were not the findings they had hoped for—and that his report would be made public. With Stern and Scott’s assurance, Wecht flew to the Bahamas.
Wecht had noticed that coroner’s representative Linda Virgill had been in the media, feeding the frenzy that Howard K. Stern was a suspect for having harmed Daniel, his girlfriend’s 20-year-old son. It was time for Wecht to learn for himself why the lad died.
In Nassau, Bahamas Dr. Wecht met with Stern; Anthony McKinney Michael Scott and his associate Tracy Ferguson; and Wayne Munroe at a local beach club after being checked into the Atlantis, one of the Caribbean’s premier resorts. Wecht spent a lengthy brunch getting their background on Daniel, Anna Nicole and Stern. Stern said that Daniel had lost 25 pounds during the summer of 2006 and that he and Anna were alarmed. Stern gave a general rundown of the boy’s health, including hospitalizations, but there was no mention of Daniel having ever had a Valium addiction. When Daniel had arrived in Nassau to meet his baby sister and see him mom again, he was so excited he practically ran into the hospital room, according to Stern.
The book discusses Stern’s financial dealings with various magazines and TV shows, which Wecht felt was common practice in the entertainment industry and good business. Photo shoots of newborns and happy families always command a top price, Wecht explains.
Howard K. Stern describes the minute-by-minute events in Anna Nicole’s hospital room during Daniel’s visit. Smith only drank water or juice, as she had never developed a taste for carbonated drinks, it was reported.
Everything seemed great, although Daniel Smith once wondered aloud why he was so tired. Howard told Wecht that the comment later haunted him.
Nassau medical examiner Dr. Raju, with whom Wecht had worked previously on other cases, performed Daniel’s primary autopsy. He welcomed his friend Wecht and together they assessed the young man’s body once more, comparing notes. They looked at his stomach contents, but there was nothing noteworthy there, such as undigested pills or capsules. As Wecht worked, he made notes which have never been reported elsewhere.
Raju had attributed Daniel’s cause of death as “accidental multiple drug toxicity,” and Wecht concurred. Raju had sent tissue samples to LabCorp, an excellent basic toxicology lab in Tampa, Florida. When the results came back, Daniel was found to have had methadone, Zoloft and Lexapro in his system at death. All three were of a high therapeutic level but the combination of the three was what sent him into a fatal downward spiral.
SSuicide was ruled out because of, among other reasons, the open joy Daniel had shown with his new baby sister, “This family that should have been looking forward to the approaching holidays together, instead of having one of them dead and the others left to defend themselves against baseless charges,” Wecht wrote.
With suicide eliminated, murder, accidental death, or undetermined were the other options for manner of death. Dr. Cyril Wecht would have his own independent toxicology tests conducted with a separate lab, before he could assert how and why Daniel expired.
Dr. Wecht sent his own samples, collected during Daniel’s second autopsy, to the National Medical Services lab in Willow Grove, Pennsylvania. In Wecht’s opinion, NMS is the premier forensic toxicology experts in the U.S., if not the world.
Following Daniel’s procedure, Dr. Cyril Wecht was met outside the morgue in the Bahamas by a barrage of media, consisting of reporters and camera crews. With Stern’s permission Wecht held an impromptu press conference, with attorneys Scott and Ferguson also present. In more than four decades of doing this work, Wecht had never seen such a constant and intense barrage of news media inquires, at the scene and for weeks to come.
After the press conference Dr. Wecht was driven to Horizons. He saw happy family photos adorning the walls, in sharp contrast to the red-rimmed eyes of Howard Stern and Anna, with whom Wecht had a touching and interesting exchange. Before she returned to her bedroom, Anna squeezed Wecht’s hand and thanked him for examining her son. “I don’t know how this happened,” Anna sobbed. “Daniel was a good boy — he wasn’t into drugs.”
The people at Horizons gave Dr. Wecht a good overview about who Daniel was and his relationship with his mother and Stern.
Later, still at Horizons, Wecht had a phone conversation with Dr. Sandeep Kapoor, who was both Anna Nicole and Daniel’s doctor. Kapoor confirmed that he had prescribed methadone for a then-pregnant Anna because it was safe for a fetus, but he had never prescribed that drug to Daniel.
When Dr. Cyril Wecht returned to the states, he saw that public interest in Daniel’s demise was still raging. Fox News’ Greta Van Susteren led a panel where talking heads suggested there had been foul play. Wecht marveled that so many people had opinions, without having seen the toxicology results yet.
Wecht spends a fair amount of time discussing how Daniel might have come to ingest the drugs that killed him. Both Stern and Anna Nicole said they did not furnish the pills, so where did Daniel get the medicine, who prescribed it to him, and why?
Over the next several weeks, Dr. Wecht continued to appear on TV shows to discuss this case, always with Stern’s blessing — but by no means did Stern have input on what Dr. Wecht would say.
Coauthor Dawna Kaufmann describes playing for private eye Jack Harding the video clip of Anna Nicole inviting Daniel to visit her in the Bahamas. This fresh insight is also exclusive to the book and fascinating to read. Harding tells of his encounters with Daniel, asking for the P.I.’s help in saving his mother.
Multiple sources—from Harding, to Anna’s mother Virgie Arthur to former pals and employees—have said Stern controlled Anna and doled out drugs to her every four hours. This book analyzes ever person’s commentary and their possible motivations.
Dr. Cyril Wecht says he received at least 20 phone calls from Stern, at all hours of the day and night, making specific requests, seeking information and urging the doctor to communicate with the toxicology labs and various people. Stern seemed to be aware of every comment about the case on every cable TV news program and in every magazine and newspaper, and appreciated Wecht’s skill in getting across accurate information in those sometimes fast-talking, sound-bite environments.
Drs. Raju and Wecht spoke frequently via their respective offices in Nassau and Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, while awaiting the final toxicology results. There’s some charming personal information about how these two expert medical detectives viewed the media storm surrounding this case.
On Nancy Grace’s Cable Headline News’ program, information was given as fact that was later disproved by toxicology reports. But Grace’s show wasn’t the only one where wild speculation occurred. Wecht talks about watching many of them and wondering if they were more vested in promoting an agenda, rather than following the facts.
Dr. Wecht has many cogent observations about Virgie Arthur and her clear pain over losing a beloved grandchild and fearing for her daughter’s well-being. And Wecht gives rich details about his views of Stern, whose sincerity seemed genuine. Of course, Wecht was also mindful of the potential giant pot of gold these people, and others, might be chasing. In looking at the motivations of the many people who had been around Anna and her son, Wecht performs psychological autopsies and holds back nothing.
This riveting book also contains new details surrounding Daniel Smith’s funeral that I have never read in any other accounts. Included is Anna Nicole Smith’s plaintive wailing: “I don’t want my husband, I want my son back. Leave me alone, leave me alone. Don’t touch me!” Rosespeaks.com readers know what the nannies’ account of the day was like, but “A Question of Murder” offers another view.
Also revealed in the book is a prescription drug that Daniel took, which Wecht declined to identify during his Nassau press conference. Wecht explains his reason for mentioning it in the book, and why it should be part of Daniel’s autopsy record now. I must say the inclusion of this drug stunned me.
Daniel Smith’s full autopsy results, including the NMS Labs toxicology, were made public in January 2007. Around the same time, in Nassau, attorney Wayne Munroe became the sole attorney for Howard K. Stern and Anna Nicole Smith. Munroe would be behind every important behind-the-scenes move for the pair from then on.
More surprises come with Dr. Wecht’s accounts of the Bahamian Coronial Inquest, including how and why it seemed to start and stop. Wecht found two inquest witnesses especially problematic, and he paints a vivid picture as to who and why. One man’s testimony was so troubling to Wecht, it evokes a series of emails and calls between the doctor and Stern.
In the final analysis, Wecht writes his truthful views of all of the players in this case — the people we know so well at Rosespeaks.com. You may agree with him, or you may disagree, but you can’t help but be impressed by his decision to expose the full spectrum of personalities and events surrounding Daniel’s death.
And Dawna Kaufmann’s research and writing nicely fills in who this tragic 20-year-old was in life, making him a complex and fun human being who never got the chance to live his life to the fullest.
As convoluted as Daniel’s investigation was, Wecht notes the sorrow he left in his loved ones’ hearts. He ends the chapter with this thought about Daniel: “Hopefully, when [people] think of him, they will remember the joy of his life, rather than the mystery of his death.”
Rose Speaks.com readers will have unprecedented access to the authors, if you bought the book and have questions, ask them here, when Rose Turner talks to the co-authors if they can they will answer them. Don’t miss this rare access to the authors of “A Question of Murder”. If you have not picked up a copy of the book both Amazon and our favorite online store Barnes and Noble has it in stock.
NEWEST FILINGS IN THE TEXAS STATE DISTRICT COURT FOR HEARING ON AUGUST 28, 2009
August 27, 2009 Rose Turner’s Objection to Art Harris Motion to Reconsider the Appointment of Craig Ball with a Request for Protective Order and Stay in the forensic exam of his electronic media.
http://www.rosespeaks.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&op=getit&lid=2367.
August 27, 2009 Rose Turner’s Exhibits B-H filed with Objection to Art Harris Motion to Reconsider the Appointment of Craig Ball with a Request for Protective Order and Stay in the forensic exam of his electronic media. Exhibit A as stated was filed for an in camera review before becoming part of the Judicial Record.
http://www.rosespeaks.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&op=getit&lid=2368.
August 28, 2009 Plaintiff Virgie Arthur’s Response to Art Harris Motion to Reconsider the Appointment of Craig Ball with a Request for Protective Order and Stay in the forensic exam of his electronic media.
http://www.rosespeaks.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&op=getit&lid=2369.
May 2009 Texas Appellate Decision of Designation of Responsible Third Parties is NOT wrong and in fact should and can be used to avoid the statute of limitations.
http://www.rosespeaks.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&op=getit&lid=2370.
©Rose Turner with the aide Dawna Kaufmann
August 27, 2009
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Tags: A Question of Murder, Anna Nicole Smith, Anna Nicole Smith's nannies, Anthony McKinney Esq., CBS-ET, Celebrity Trials, Chief Coronor Linda Virgill, Daniel Smith, Daniel Smith autopsy, Daniel Smith's funeral, Daniel Smtih Autopsy, Daniel Wayne Smith's Death Investigation, Dannielynn, Dawna Kaufmann, Dawna Kaufmann - A Question of Murder, Dr Cyril Wecht - A Question of Murder, Dr. Cyril Wecht, Dr. Cyril Wecht and Dawna Kaufmann, Dr. Raju, Dr. Raju - Nassau medical examiner, Dr. Sandeep Kapoor, Entertainment Tonight, Greta Van Susteren, High Profile Trials, Horizons - Anna Nicole Smith's home, Howard K Stern, Jack Harding, Jack Harding P. I., LabCorp Tampa Florida, Linda Virgill, Michael Scott Esq., Nancy Grace, Nassau Bahamas, National Medical Services, Tracy Ferguson Esq., Virgie Arthur, Wayne Munroe, Wayne Munroe Esq.
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August 26, 2009 Art Harris Notice of Appearance for August 27, 2009 of Chip Babcock and Nancy Hamilton and correct their state bar numbers that was filed with the wrong numbers for the wrong lawyers previously.
http://www.rosespeaks.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&op=getit&lid=2366
Rose ~~ once again great article :-) I have a question concerning something Wecht wrote in his book and it is in reference to Jack Harding but gonna wait until my buddy AJM [cause she bought the book] is on. She and I had asked this question numerous times during our stint over at TMZ and every time we would ask, the wolves practically devoured us over there.
AJM ~~ if you should read this and I am not on then feel free to ask that question, you know which one ;-)
I disagree, a little like planting ‘Tulips’ and getting a ‘Barrel Cactus’, that is all I will say at this time.
John J. Nazarian, P.I.
Wow! I so look forward to the discussions of this book. Unfortunately, being on a fixed income (disabled) I can not afford to purchase this book. I hope I can ask questions to understand what was written by Dr. Wecht. On another board during the Scott Peterson/Laci Peterson trial people had a book lending list where one person was generous enough to buy a book and send it to the next person on the list to read. Is there a possibility to do that here? The site owner created a thread where people signed up to participate in this exchange and address were PM’d to the next person, and so on and so forth. Is anyone willing to do this?
I am glad that Dr. Wecht has written this book! I hope it puts things into perspective for all, and maybe will lay to rest some of the rumors that have gone around and correct some “facts” that have been stated.
There is one thing that I have noticed on many message boards dealing with many topics. People seem to be so cut-throat anymore. i.e., they want to see someone have the worst things happen to people with little or no basis in fact of their guilt (often just based in rumor). What is happening to us? We elect a president based on the leftist run media hype without recognizing that the man actually had little to no experience to prepare him for the office. Are people just lambs being lead to slaughter anymore? Do we not have the time to use our brains to think things through? It is a very, very scary thing to witness. This case with Howard Stern is a prime example. People just WANT to assume the worst of someone and the personal anger expressed is so out of proportion to the reality of the situation. They do not want to hear reality! It is just like “Give me someone to beat up ’cause I am so mad”. I just don’t understand the “masses” anymore.
Once again, thank Rose for this wonderful site. It is so refreshing to have a site that gives you all of the facts (not one-sided) and encourages people to think, reflect and discuss. Hope your health is improving and the stresses will soon be over for you and Ken and all others connected to this sad situation.
Reading the chapter on Daniel it appears that HKS told Dr. Wecht about the photo he had taken on ANS request of her and a deceased Daniel. It appears that Dr. Wecht new about that photo before it ever came out in the news media. Also what happened to all the “undissolved pills” that VA supporters are always screaming about? Dr. Wecht puts that little puppy to rest and clearly states there was NO pills in his stomach.
#4 noni “Wow! I so look forward to the discussions of this book. Unfortunately, being on a fixed income (disabled) I can not afford to purchase this book. I hope I can ask questions to understand what was written by Dr. Wecht. On another board during the Scott Peterson/Laci Peterson trial people had a book lending list where one person was generous enough to buy a book and send it to the next person on the list to read. Is there a possibility to do that here? The site owner created a thread where people signed up to participate in this exchange and address were PM’d to the next person, and so on and so forth. Is anyone willing to do this?”
Let me see what we can do to fix this and that you have what is needed to ask the questions and join the dialogue…
I want to ask 2 questions… I want to ask Dawna Kauffmann about her personal meeting with Jack Harding…
I want to ask Dr. Wecht about the “soda” and metabolizes the Methadone quicker, I thought we had read it was Anna’s grapefruit juice that a study on that and how it interacts was actually asked at the Inquest… but those are the 2 questions I have.
Roxanne (msg #5) That is what I was talking about – “Rumor vs Facts”. There were no undesolved pills! I believe both autopsy’s proved that. However, some people (even though the reality is pointed out to them) want to hang onto their “anger” and the “truth” does not fit into their beliefs. Why are people so anger oriented that they would discard the facts? Is it a case of their lives being so unmanageable that they transfer it to something like this where they feel they are in control of the situation/outcome? I just can not see a scenario that does not include the real FACTS of a situation. Here are some FACTS in this situation:
There were NO undesolved pills in Daniels stomach!
Anna asked Howard to take the “Death” picture with her and Daniel.
Why did she ask for that picture? I don’t think it was for the media. I believe she was hanging on to the idea that Daniel came to her with the feeling of – “I am so happy to be here with you and am so happy to see my new sister!; and it is the last picture that I will ever have with my son.” I don’t believe it was Howard being so forward thinking (at that time) as to take a picture that would bring in money. It IS a normal practice in the south to take last pictures of the dead. Like it or not Howard is a real person that was trying to help Anna anyway he could in the midst of the most horrible situation anyone could imagine happening. It is obvious that he cared very deeply for her! As I have said, this is my opinion.
The death picture has never worried me. A lot of people have photos and I took one of my mum when she was laid out in the hospital. I wanted the bitter sweet thing of last moments on earth type of memory. My choice and a private moment. I haven’t printed it out it is just in my pics folder..but I have it.
The ” No pills or capsules in Daniels stomach” doesn’t connect Daniel to the pills in the bed.
No pills in his jeans pockets or the police would have found them when they found Jack Hardings card in his jeans.
I want to know if Anna’s meds were given to the nurses to give to her during her stay in hospital and if her meds were in the room or with the medical staff.
The weight loss he showed is a worry 25 pounds and of interest. Shows something was up with this young man.
Good book and I was able to follow the story line easily and with our knowlege of the story as well it made heaps of sense and some things did jump out…
8
Noni
Exactly. There was no taking of that picture for media and money. The allegations are that it got into the hands of Teams Tx and that a particular person from that team handed it over to a VA supporter who blogged regularly at the time and that this person was asked to distribute that picture on the web. I don’t know if that is true or not but allegedly it comes straight from the blogger who originally posted it for all to see.
What exactly do you disagree with, John?
I am like Noni too, for a different reason. I cannot find the book here, and will not purchase online. So please elaborate a bit more on quotes from the book. Pretty please???
Also want to point out that this book does not make HKS a hero or a bad guy. It ask some questions about certain things from Dr. Wecht’s intimate dealings with him after Daniel and then ANS death. What it does show is that clearly HKS was not responsible for neither death. He murdered no one.
Thank you Rose! Lizzie, you comment “please elaborate a bit more on quotes from the book. Pretty please???” is a good one. When quoting and commenting if the writer could include the comment or the gist of it, it would be a help for those of us who don’t have the book.
Roxanne, I like what you said “Also want to point out that this book does not make HKS a hero or a bad guy”, that is an important point IMO. In your opinion, was this an objective book? Would others think the same?
ROSE OR ANYONE—I would like to know TRUE FACTS,after reading Daniel chapter,there are a lot of questions,ONE–Howard said he knew nothing about Daniel drug taking.Now if Daniel was in ICU at a CAL hospital for the taking of VALIUM next of kin had to be notified,SO did Anna know and NOT tell Howard?TWO–GBT was in Anna’s Hospital room the night before Daniel died,so to me it seems funny Vergie said there were three people in the room and daniel did not overdose himself,never mentioning GBT been there the night before.THIRD–Anna called Daniel to come to the Bahamas to see his sister,If Jack Harding was correct(WHICH HE WAS A LIAR) Daniel would not have agreed to be pick up by Stern.The biggest JOKE of all. was vergie.stating she was upset Daniel had not been buried yet,and VERGIE stating The last bit of respect you get in this world is at a funeral,and my baby has not had one’.In the first place,if Vergie had any feeling whatsoever,(which she does not),I SURE UNDERSTAND,maybe Anna did not want to let go,and see her Son buried,what the hell kind of Mother does not understand that.Vergie showed as much DISRESPECT TO HER DAUGHTER SHE COULD SHOW,Anna body was held up in the heat FOR VERGIE(DISRESPECT) bringing reporters with MAMA to her Daughters funeral (STINKS) DISRESPECT.not wearing pink,or bringing pink flowers no matter how SHE felt,Can you even think what she would have done at Daniel funeral,as it is Vergie all ENTERTAINMENT TONIGHT ,to broker a deal for his memorial service.Daniel could have gotten the methadone anywhere,did not Larry say Daniel was in his Mother’s Home in Cal,and got caught on video.
OK because I’m not sure when AJM will be here I will go ahead and address what she and I have always questioned.
Ford Shelley claimed that when Daniel’s things were taken to the Horizon, Howard rummaged through Daniel’s pants pocket and supposedly found pills. Shelley then said Howard went into the bathroom to which Shelley claims he heard the toilet flush and Howard made some sort of comment like “I took care of that problem” something to that effect. Well Wecht said in his book, detectives wanted to know why Harding’s business card was found among Daniel’s belongs, “which had been confiscated before the items were given to Howard.” If this is the case then how could the detectives miss those supposed pills that Shelley claims Howard flushed down the toilet. IMO Shelley out and out lied about those pills.
heath [9] you must have been reading over my shoulder while I was typing about the supposed pills in Daniel’s pocket
thanks, that is exactly what AJM and I question from the beginning
Wecht even questions why when Daniels pockets were gone through the detectives did not find those supposed two white pills. He said even the assistant police commissioner said that no drug paraphernalia or traces of illegal drugs were found on Daniel.
Beverly: why would Anna have to be notified when Daniel was in the emergency/ICU? He may have requested that she NOT be notified for all we know. Has anyone seen the documentation from that hospital stay? I don’t recall any info on that. No one said he was “unconsious” and unable to make decions for himself.
As far as the funeral stuff goes, Vergie only honored whatever SHE wanted obviously. It was “all about Vergie” in that farce.
Yes, I remember reading that Daniel had been caught on video at Anna’s house. The methadone very well could have been taken from there by him; that is as valid as the supposition that he got it from Anna. Depends on your point of view, right?
JMA- right on! on your comments. The detectives searched Daniel’s clothing and found ONLY the card …. NO PILLS! Jeeze, that’s another of those rumors people hang onto to justify their position!
One last thought, how in the h$ll does Virgie know how many people were in the hospital room and what Daniel did or didn’t do? More rumor from someone who has a big stake in this situation, right? That is not FACT! Ford has done alot of things he said Anna told him to do, but Anna is not here to verify that is she? Anyone who takes Ford’s word as fact is only doing so because it supports their “side”.
I would like to say something about Anna taking medication to the hospital and taking it (remember Larry testifying about the bag of meds?). I am a severe chronic pain person and am treated through a reputable Pain Mgmt Center that is run by a hospital in our area. I had to go through more surgery for my condition. I was told, BY THE HOSPITAL, to bring my mediciation with me. After surgery, I daily took the same dosage of my own meds and whatever meds the doctor thought I needed for pain above what I was taking. My point? It is not unheard of, nor illegal, to take your routine meds with you to a hospital as long as the doctor and the hospital staff know what you are taking.
Did anyone investigate to see if this was the case with Anna? People (and the press) are willing to say that if she took meds brought from home it was soooo wrong and if Howard gave her the pills, he was doing something wrong. Incomplete reporting and falsely leading people to believe it was wrong (if it even happened). I dare anyone to investigate this further! It just blows my mind that people would jump on her taking some pills prescribed to her as meaning she was “drugging”without her doctor knowing!
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A Question of Murder: Compelling Cases from a Famed Forensic Pathologist.(Brief… Publishers Weekly August 25, 2008 700+ words A Question of Murder: Compelling Cases from a Famed Forensic Pathologist Cyril H. Wecht and Dawna Kaufmann, foreword…assassination to the murder of Laci Peterson, forensic pathologist Wecht dissects five recent high-profile cases…
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A Question of Murder.(A Question of Murder: Compelling Cases from a Famed… Internet Bookwatch March 1, 2009 700+ words A Question of Murder Cyril H. Wecht, MD, JD and…26.98 www.prometheusbooks.com A QUESTION OF MURDER: COMPELLING CASES FROM A FAMED FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST comes from a forensic pathologist who has dissected the greatest, performing…
Heath #9 ‘ I kept my own meds in my room and took them at the appropriate times.
NONI——-Daniel,may well have said not to notify his mother,but they do have to have the next of kin .on there records.I do not think his roommate would want to take responsibility.if anything happen to Daniel.Daniel loved his mother,he would not suggest not to call his mother.Drugs or not.
Beth, you still have to live in America, and I don’t! ;-)
Beth #20- THANK YOU for that valuable info! I have saved the site to my “important” file and will definately use it. That is a big help.
NONI——they wanted your med bottles to check on what you were taking and what dosage and what doctor,I WILL TELL YOU RIGHT NOW,NO WAY,AND iImean NO WAY ,would you be given any meds from the bottle you brought in.no doctor I ever worked with would ever do that.
Beverly #22 – that is what I believe. It is interesting that some people automatically take as a FACT that she WAS notified and she and Howard knew all about it. My goal is to separate the fact from the fiction (or jumping to a conclustion). I think if we omit those kind of things and only use the provable facts it might be very valuable.
Lizzie, that is right dear! My BAD!
I am so sorry, well then for Noni. [24] You are very welcome Miss Noni.
If America cannot seem to fix this Health Care Crisis soon, I am going to move to another country I think!
*** Ken, I left you some info about this new singer on a few threads back…
*** JMA, Yes, I agree with you! Isn’t he wild? I bet if Danyl can get a few other songs that everyone likes and performs them as well… he may win! :D
(a few other songs for the upcoming auditions – I mean)
Beverly #25. I was raised in the north. Up until my surgery’s down south that was the rule. You were never alowed to bring meds to a hospital. Your doctor would notify the hospital of what you routinely took. I am not making up a story here! That was exactly what happened during my surgery at a hospital in the southern state I now live in. I was instructed to bring my meds to the hospital and take my regular doses. They supplement my pain medications to adjust for the surgery. FACT, not fiction!
Beverly maybe this is a good example of how some rumors are taken or discarded as fact/not fact. You KNOW that it could not have happened that I took my own meds in the hospital because that has been you experience/training. I know where you are coming from, but I also tell you that it is a FACT that this is the way things were handled at the hospital where I had my surgery. I am not lying to you.
Beth, I agree with you about the very scary situation our health care system is in! I had a bad experience with my Grandmother. She was in her early 90’s. Her gallbladder became infected. They put her on antibiotics in the hospital. It didn’t help her and she was in a great deal of pain. Days went by and I finally went and found her doctor to talk about it. He actually told me that at her age they don’t usually do surgery and just let nature take it’s course. I blew up at him and told him that my grandmother could litterely run rings around me with her activites, etc. He told me, based on what I had told him, they reconsidered and would do the surgery. It worried me so bad that, had I not done what I did, they would have let her die! Let that be a lesson to everyone, it will only get worse if they do that government sponsered health care system. Very eye-opening and terrifying. I am now in my 60’s and am very worried.
Noni [18] you know I never thought about that, how did VA know there was only three people in that room was it disclosed through the media at the time she made that statement and if not who told her and why did they not tell her that G Ben Thompson had been there as well. I think it was G Ben was there until around midnight.
Wecht also disputes the claim/rumor that the Lexapro and Zoloft were seven times the expected dosage and he should know he ordered and viewed the toxicology report he said both were in nonlethal range.
Oops caught another discrepancy. I remember hearing that Ford Shelley said it was he and Ben’s son Gaither who brought Daniel’s clothing to the house and that Howard told them to toss them up to him or something to that effect [anyone else remember that??] but Wetch says different. Wetch says that Ford and Gaither were already at the Horizon when Howard showed up later carrying Daniel’s belongings.
“981. And So It Begins – 4-7-2009
• Prosecutors placed on notice today to hand over discovery – now!
• HKS and Dr. E side-by-side in Court – attempt to separately arraign Dr. E thwarted.
• Original arraignment date for all of HKS/K/E re-established – May 13, 2009.
• As anticipated, the defense begins:
Steve Sadow, lead criminal defense attorney for HKS, addresses the media crush after HKS’s brief Court appearance. In command voice, Sadow puts JB on notice that he has flown in from Atlanta for the sole purpose of defending HKS from JB’s baseless claims and political ambition.
Sadow also decries the trashing of ANS and the invasion of her privacy that has occurred because of JB and vows not to let it stand.
Why no discovery yet from the prosecutors? Any ‘legitimate’ investigation of two years’ duration would have discovery all set and ready to go BEFORE criminal charges were even filed. Let’s all see the ‘evidence’ and the ‘witnesses’ that are criminal court trial ready – and let’s see them now!
Posted at 6:46PM on Aug 27th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean”
“982. Arraignment of HKS/K/E 5-13-09
• United in a common defense – the truth
All three affirm pleas of ‘not guilty’ and as HKS’s main Attorney Steve Sadow stated after the proceeding:
“Every one of the people in this case contends that there was no crime, because in fact, there was no crime.”
Sadow provided the insight that he will issue a general demurrer in this case should a preliminary hearing not be successful in having the charges dismissed. 6-8-09 is the day the Court will set a date for a preliminary hearing. A general demurrer would state that even if the acts charged, as written, were all true, those acts do not amount to a crime. This has been discussed at length on previous threads. City Prosecutor Renee Rose opinioned that a preliminary hearing could easily last two weeks – no doubt!
• TX cabal-related docs to remain confidential by Court order for now.
An astounding revelation today was that a 1400-page brief exists for these charges and that some of its contents relate directly to ongoing ‘Smith-related’ cases in NY and TX. We know that material has been funneled by the O’Q/VA operatives from the Cosby and ‘bloggers’ lawsuits and that this material can only be the lies, rumors and innuendos that the TX cabal has defamed HKS and others with for over two years.
More indication that the politically active AG of CA has been suckered into charging people with crimes that don’t exist at the urging of outside agitators with their own nefarious purpose. More indication that HKS/K/E have been targeted for criminal prosecution based on peculiar moral considerations that have no place in the Court room; exemplified by JB’s early derogatory use of the non-legal term ‘chief enabler’ to describe HKS.
• Release the 1400-page brief!
The Cosby and ‘bloggers’ cases are toast, as we see proof that the defamation from Cosby and VA’s people continues; time for the media to inquire with renewed interest what the connection between these two civil cases and the CA criminal case is.
Posted at 6:46PM on Aug 27th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean”
“977. I notice continued crying about Seidlin’s Court:
Well, we all know that Seidlin’s rulings were upheld by a 3 Judge panel in the FL Appeals Court and every word of his rulings was honored by the Bahamian Justices in the Appeals Court in Nassau. Both appeals brought by VA and both flatly denied. Posted on Aug 27th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean”
NONI——I am glad my nursing days are over,I cannot believe what is going on today,my pet peve right now is to watch nurses,walking around stores with there uniform on,GERMS IN,GERMS OUT.NONI, lets pretend you are a drug addict,now you hand the doctor a bottle that says VALIUM 10mg TID but in that bottle is another drug that looks the same,what a BIG BIG LAWSUIT FOR THE HOSPITAL.
General Demmurer -
“Demurrers are general and special, and demurrers to evidence, and to interrogatories. A General Demurrer is one which excepts to the sufficiency of a previous pleading in general terms, without showing specifically the nature of the objection; and such demurrer is sufficient, when the objection is on matter of substance.” http://www.lectlaw.com/def/d132.htm
Everytime my mom went to the hosipital, whether it was an emergency or not, I bagged up her prescriptions and she took them along. The hospital wants to know what prescriptions are being taken.
Beverly [25] The northern part of the country and the southern part of the country are almost two different countries, in the way they do things. Stuff they do up north, wouldn’t be done down here, or even thought of. And vice versa. (and it’s also a different one in the Midwest too.
)
Beth [27] Thanks.
Beverly – My pain mgmt doctors are affiliated with the hospital that I had my surgery at. Maybe that had something to do with it? It surprised me too when they told me to bring my meds with me and to take my regular doses. As I said, I was raised in the North and my past experiences did not allow that. Pain Mgmt is done with anesthesiologist for my shots and pain meds. They are the same doctors that do the anesthesia during hospital surgeries. I was told to call down to them if I had any problem with pain after my surgery (which I wound up doing). Anyhoo, that was my experience.
http://www.lectlaw.com/def/d132.htm
“DEMURRER – From the Latin demorari or old French demorrer, to wait or stay. In pleading, imports that the objecting party will not proceed with the pleading, because no sufficient statement has been made on the other side; but will wait the judgment of the court whether he is bound to answer. Demurrers are no longer available in Federal and many state courts. In Federal Courts the equivalents are often various motions pursuant to F.R.Civ.P. Rule 14.
A demurrer may be for insufficiency either in substance or in form. That is, it may be either on the ground that the case shown by the opposite party is essentially insufficient, or on the ground that it is stated in an inartificial manner; for the law requires two things in every pleading; that it be in matter sufficient, and that it be deduced and expressed according to the forms of law. It is cause for demurrer if either of these be wanting. A demurrer is of two kinds; general or special.”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
QUESTION: Why isn’t CBS, TMZ, Lin Wood, FILING A DEMURRER in TL’s Court? Forcing the issue of showing ‘the harm or injury’ of the plaintiff to be expressed according to the forms of law.
2nd Question: Should not that have been done before any Orders that costs the defendant’s money or to violate their possessions?
One WORD — APPEAL
by all defendants to – *Unsubstantiated Orders according to law*.
“That is, it may be either on the ground that the case shown by the opposite party is essentially insufficient, or on the ground that it is stated in an inartificial manner; for the law requires two things in every pleading; that it be in matter sufficient, and that it be deduced and expressed according to the forms of law.”
Noni [30] I am so glad you used your strong voice w/ those doctors!
Your Grandmother is lucky to have you!
Have to take off, have a nice evening everyone.
JMA #31 – I love it when we put our “thinking caps” on! Good points!
August 27, 2009 Rose Turner’s Objection to Art Harris Motion to Reconsider the Appointment of Craig Ball with a Request for Protective Order and Stay in the forensic exam of his electronic media.
http://www.rosespeaks.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&op=getit&lid=2367
August 27, 2009 Rose Turner’s Exhibits B-H filed with Objection to Art Harris Motion to Reconsider the Appointment of Craig Ball with a Request for Protective Order and Stay in the forensic exam of his electronic media. Exhibit A as stated was filed for an in camera review before becoming part of the Judicial Record.
http://www.rosespeaks.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&op=getit&lid=2368
Rose?
Was that objection written in collusion with McCabe?
noni another perspective is this one,thought I am so glad your voice was heard,IMO health insurance companies them selves determine those kindsof things My sister -in law had an HMO sya she had to leave a hospital setting even thoug she still had brain swellin so he scalp could not be reattached, different people different hospitals different insurance plans and companies .
2 years ago my COBRA ran out in Georgia, I went around in circles trying to find insurance because I became injured on the job, numerous surgeries, was classified with a catastrophic injury and to retain my original Blue Cross Blue Shield was going to cost me almost 900 a month, yep, 900 dollars a month. Same insurance I had while employed and it jumped over 700 dollars a month. So for almost 4 years I had no insurance, was still waiting for Disability, wasn’t allowed to work and couldn’t find any assistance from our capital patooties, including our insurance commissioner. Nothing the insurance company was doing was illegal so nothing could help me. I have very little patience for any of these ignorant, incompetent so called experts telling me anything.
Noni [42] thank you :-) there is still a lot more reading to do then of course got to try and go back on memory as to who said what and when they said it, but you know the saying “two heads are better than one” well in this case, several heads are phenomenal ;-)
What I was getting at was Anna taking methadone in the hospital and was it in the room. In plain site or no meds in the room. But no proof exists that the mehtadone was Anna’s pg 42
No pills or capsules but liquid?
But that still leaves the anti depressants. Zoloft and Lexapro. see pg 37 38 39( Dr Kapoor prescribed the Lexapro pg 43) and Topamax an anti seizure med that Anna also took..pg 55.
So this is why I am connecting to Anna’s meds she took at the time of giving birth and might have had them in her hospital room..
But a simple explanation of what happend is “Sudden Adult Death Syndrome” and all 3 drugs can cause it and all 3 drugs taken together !!!!
#45 NO Lizzie it was written because I need to establish a record for the appellate court… Read the exhibit and the Motion is about Art Harris’ attorneys going after me any way they can because as the Objection state that have astutely turned it from Harris to me cause if they dumped Harris they could not represent CBS
I have a news flash for y’all I was much closer to collusion with Jackson Walker then I ever was with VA’s ppl…
Isn’t it grand on this site you can ask those questions Lizzie…
OK guys I will pick up the questions from this thread tonight, and get the answers if there are answers from the 2 authors… Good discussion ..
13
Noni
Yes it is an objective book. There are questions that Dr. Wecht has for HKS that haven’t been answered. There are questions he has of alot of people that haven’t been answered and he makes comments about the “probable importance” or the “usefulness” of certain things. He states at times he was shocked by things that came out after their death in the media (for instance the faxed list of drugs Dr. E. wanted filled for ANS). AT the same time he points out that there is no denying they were BOTH accidental deaths due to their drug use and NOT MURDER OR FOUL PLAY OF ANY KIND.
14
Beverly
There is a quote in the ANS chapter that was alledged to have happened that shows that Daniel was in no way afraid of HKS. It’s about HKS picking on Daniel about being a 19 year old virgin and Daniels reported come back is anything but a person afraid of the one they are talking to.
15
JMA
I have always asked that question and it is an obvious on to ask. I believe the answer is because the thing with HKS flushing pills never happened.
19
Noni
Excellent point. I to have been told to bring my meds from home with me when I recently had surgery and when I have it again in a few weeks, I’m sure that I will be told the same again.
Roxanne #51. Thanks for the enlightenment about the book. So much for our HIPPA laws, right?
Curious, do you live in the south?
You know folks, I have been thinking about this for 2 hours.. about Lizzie’s post all of the Rose bashing I am hearing about on so many forums and yet we are transparent here even if it MAKES me look bad.
Go through the time line… you want collusion, how about JW would NOT touch Art Harris for a year… and then suddenly when I filed that Motion to Designate a Third Party on Jan. 30, 2009, JW signed up for Harris’ lawyers the next business day.. ALL of them big guns.. let’s see what kind of collusion is there if a party can not come in and object to being added because the statute clearly forbids that so they contact a defendant to open the door for them and allow them to piggy back off of him to fight for their real client CBS… do you really think Art has any pull like that.. Mmmmmmmmmmmm and who did Art end up having to contact for a possible lawyer after JW said no way, no how, NEVER… Mmmmmmmmm collusion with a party to piggy pack off of them to come in and fight for your real client which you are forbidden to do by statute.. Now you have them bringing in more experts and fighting the good fight for “their client” because they can not fire this one client even if records show he fabricated a few things because to withdraw as his attorney means you can not come in for your real client CBS… that would be a “conflict of interest”…
Now any questions about the meaning of “collusion”?????
I am going to love watching them backed into a corner and no where to go except after just a blogger in east Texas… I don’t know VA, I don’t know HKS, I don’t know LB and I don’t want to know any of them… it is simple I began to blog and opened this site so we could “converse” in a dialog without slamming each other… thus I am “transparent” even when it makes me look like shit. That is what “transparency” is about, not hiding anything… perhaps one defendant and their mega lawyers might learn a lesson about that. Don’t threaten a sick woman who you have met and know how sick she is with a “Criminal Collusion” and jail… it is not nice
I am NOT in VA’s fold, I am not in any of the other defendants fold, I am out here in a nest of rattlesnakes with the ice on the ocean giving way… perhaps that will help you understand what several of us feel like these days just a tad???
Roxanne,
I am thinking only good thoughts and prayers for you now and especially in a few weeks.
Keep strong mentally and everything will be alright.
Your friend,
Beth
#45 There were hundred different better ways to ask that question, I think.
Okay, I read the new documents. Thank you. I do have to say that the rosespeaks blog about Art Harris and Ball painted Art in a bad light. Don’t know if that was the intention, but it certainly left that impression. I don’t blame Art for complaining. I do think it is bizarre for a (co) defendant to be blogging about the case in which she is a part of. Why do it? It is no different, imo, than what wmila vcie is doing. Titillating for sure, but credible? Nah, it stinks big time to me. But hey, I keep reading and commenting, don’t I? rofl.
OOPS… I hadn’t refreshed, as had to stop to yell at my washing machine…
Did not see [53] until after I submitted. Sorry.
trina [55] If you think rose and the blog is that bad and such, why do you keep on coming back and reading and commenting?
#56 NP Beth, we had to make a decision be transparent or look like we are lying??? Tough choice to have to make… I keep saying ppl don’t have all of the pieces to this puzzle it is much different then it looks on the surface because I am muzzled on a LOT of the stuf…
And please any and all of you send me a list of cases you want to follow and I would love to sift gears here, cause this case is enough to give the strongest of the strong ulcers… so trina do we not post all of the documents from all sides? Do we close the blog, because a lot of days that would be the easiest thing to do? Do we say NEVER again no ANS that wouldn’t that be censorship… if you have an out on this trina or any of you who set in judgment then for God’s sake share it
And Red and MaryST get a grip, did you read this part: “The official records of Smith County must be consulted prior to any legal reliance.” as in many times they are WRONG
Now carry on in your new sand box darlin Daisy cause you are the gift that gives on giving and giving and giving, better then the energizer bunny at the holidays
55
Trina
What I got from reading those papers is that Ball asked some questions about others computers that weren’t handed over for imaging and now all the sudden Art Harris wants to cry foul about his appointment. Now my opinion about Ball is that he needs to be the hell out of it. He says plainly on his site that he NEVER works for the defendant and to me that says he goes into these type cases with a little prejudice toward the defendants in the first place. But, it appears that Art Harris was very pro active in agreeing with EVERYONE else, including his attorney at the time, to allow Ball to be the forensic guy. My question is why cry foul now when some questions were asked of him? Why not just answer the questions. The email exhibits show that Harris wasn’t being accused of anything yet. I just don’t get it. You agree to it then lay in the bed you made when others have already done the same. IMO it would have been best to have another expert but I don’t believe any of the defendants had a clue what would happen once this guy involved. Bonnies computer wasn’t trashed. Her IT guy explained everything including that he had made full, untouched copies of the hard drive and they would hand them over but Bonnie was slapped with a default judgement. Lyndal’s email account and password are in this guys hands for him to go through all her emails. A copy of TS laptop is now in this guys hands to be gone through. Art Harris’ computer shows he had installed and used other hard drives and zip drives in the time frame of the court order so why weren’t those handed over and why cry foul when they are asked about? It could be all completely innocent and could have been his son’s plugging in zip drives for homework or something but IMO it makes it look a little bad to cry foul when they are asked about instead of just answering the questions.
Now I will pick up the list of questions in the morning to ask Dawna Kaufmann and Dr. Wecht… I am thrilled they are willing to talk to us here, it is an exciting door opening for Rose Speaks
So keep asking questions about this chapter so we can get them all together and I have a clear head and don’t stumble and stammer with authors of this caliber
Ken, the same reason I go to TOPIX.
Bingo!, Trina is a Topix commentator and is not here to intelligently discuss but insight some sort of response that she can fight about, Thanks #62 & #55 for making that clear I am Rolling on the floor Laughing my ass off at you, Go back to the pit and share that you got a response, Run along little doggie imo! Fu*k I hate stupid people, I don’t know how you do it Ken & Rose you both have a great ability to suffer fools, I just don’t have that ability, Kudos to you Rose and Ken.
I don’t have that kind of patience
The facts of the TX case are not coming out as soon as we want, I think that is due to the fact that the Judge is not following any known law in her state or any other state for that matter, Imo in the TX case all the Judges to date decisions will be overruled on appeal, imo.
I think in California they will follow the law and what Howard is charged with only a licenced Dr’s can be charged with and that and they can’t charge a family member or spouse or boyfriend/girlfriend with following Dr’s recommendations. Even if in special cases like a celebrity that wants to insure privacy, That is only a spank to the Dr’s and not to a none professional!, Serious look up the laws and does anyone who is not so vested in seeing Howard out of the way think that kind of practice does not happen everyday in Hollywood, Is this out of the norm?, ( Please don’t say MJ ) He was completely out of the norm! and regards to the SC case I think that will be followed through and NY will go to trial, I would not be surprised if the firm is not added in the SC hearings/trial as well as SB and NM, that is just my predictions for 2010 imo, Oh and the reason that we are not seeing what JJudgeChin said is because Rita is fighting what his ruling about the sex tape imo
, Just my opinion
S/b – anywho please excuse errors, I hope everyone is well!..
good morning everyone—well today and tomorrow will be busy,My sister is bringing the kids here for a overnighterJulie physiologist thinks she needs to came to see auntie and have some fun,She cut to pieces the tee-shirt she was wearing.when she was attact on main street,This very thing is what I was talking about with Anna,Vergie should have done something to help Anna,It must have been all bottled up inside her.I also find it strange Daniel and his mother ,had stomach problems and seizures,and I do wonder with all Daniel problems,why he roomate,would have not notified Anna.
so #53….are you saying that CBS is trying to lay the whole suit at your feet?
OMG! Liann. I’m not that kind of poster on Topix. I’m one of three or four over there that try to keep it real. I take a lot of abuse, but it doesn’t stop me. Vcie has even addressed me by, what she thinks is, my given name. And I do not take anything from here to there. Although, my topix posts have been brought here and talked about favorably. Go figure. Here at rosespeaks, I do not try and incite anything. Right now I am bothered by the constant comments about how this case is going to be won only on appeal, comments about if we all only knew what was going on we would be shocked, and then the latest blurb about a betrayal. Well I’m not going to shocked by anything that happens, or comes out. I haven’t in the past, and won’t be in the future.
Liann [63] spot on girl and I agree.
This is my opinion concerning Art Harris’s situation, he is journalist and he knew what he was getting into when he started putting up stories concerning the Anna Nicole saga. Now Harris’s has bigwig Attorneys to fight his battle unlike the three defendant bloggers that were added in order to gain jurisdiction on HKS. I feel Rose, Lyndal and Butterfly are handling their end the best they can considering they do not have council. IMO it’s a matter of, you must do what you must do in order to get through this mess. If it were not for the O’Quinn Law Firm Virgie Arthur would not have stood a chance. The only reason the estrange mother of Anna Nicole Smith has gotten this far is cause O’Quinn Law Firm saw and are still seeing $$$$$!
PS,
If no one likes my opinion tuff shit, it’s mine and it is how I have felt from the very beginning of this mess.
OK rant over, OMG that felt good.
Questions about altitude change while on medication.
> It has been reported that DWS did not like to fly, therefore may have ‘STRESSED’ his body and mind over a long flight from CA to the Bahamas.
> Many hours, maybe even a plane change on the trip,could have caused an addition of altitude changes within a short period of time.
* Stress can be psychosomatic, that stress (fear/worry) will lead to real aches and pains in a persons body. Pain especially in lower back, so if DWS was self medicating pain meds with his anti-anxiety prescriptions and took too much, would it be a different outcome if he had not been on a long plane ride?
[ Did changing altitude do anything to his body to make DWS absorb more, or not feel better even after taking pills. If so, could this be why he took so many, or did he not take too many and the altitude changes just made if worse than it had to be? ]
** With most accidental drug mixes or overdoses, DOES THE HEART JUST GIVE OUT or DO THE LUNGS STOP BREATHING FIRST?
Thank You.
Comment: I am so very sorry a young life is gone, thousands every year (all different ages) pass away from mixing medicines accidentally.
trina [68] The comments about this case being won on appeals, not at trial, are because off the judge we’re up in front of and how everything she rules is in McC’s favor. If you look at everything she’s ruled on, how she’s given everything to him that he’s wanted, denied or just refused to hear anything by the defendants, the logical conclusion is that McC basically has this thing won, in her court. (bold for emphasis on just her court) As you know from following this case, the judge doesn’t follow the law (heck, she has to ask McC at times what the law is and what she has the authority to do, ie jailing people), she ignores or just completely disregards/tosses out rulings by higher courts, makes ‘I said so’ rulings (see Dec 11 transcript). With all that, do you think the defendants have a snowballs chance in hell of winning in front of her? (even if it’s a jury trial, she can over rule the jury’s decision and rule in favor of McC, which I have no doubt she would do)
As for the stuff going on behind the scenes, anybody with common sense should know that the public is not getting the full picture of this case (due to things going on that the public are not privy to nor can be revealed, for the time being) yet there seems to be a lack of that common sense and it seems a whole lot of people are taking the little bit that they are allowed to see as being the whole picture and making accusations (most false) and threats against us. It’s like they read the front and back cover and the inside cover of the book and believe they know what the whole book is about.
Beth [70] good point Stress/Anxiety can have or cause many different effects on a person.
Ken [71] in reference to this part of your post “It’s like they read the front and back cover and the inside cover of the book and believe they know what the whole book is about.” exactly ;-)
Bewildered [67] Not quite the whole case, just enough to try to get them off the hook and out of it.
JMA [69] Don’t forget, the OQ Law Firm has lots of $$ to throw at this case however they want, usually to cause the smaller firms that don’t have the deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep pockets like they do, to fold and withdrawl. (hint hint).
Ken [75] that is why they O’Quinn Law Firm are taking advantage/intimidating those who cannot afford the same deep pocket Attorneys. It’s as though they are sending the message “pick on the little people” in order to get what you want.
With my first cup of coffee, y’all are going to love this one:
___________________________________________________________________
Rosespeaks.com A/K/A Rose Turner A/K/A Nelda Turner
On your site you have used a part of my last name ST. Please remove that portion from any comments you make about me. I use my name to do business and do not use part of my last name blogging.
I responded to post made by redcouch and you have no right to drag me into your problems with the courts.
Please refrain from using my name to promote hits to your blog. I am not a defendant and do not run a website and have every right to privacy and anonymous blogging. If you continue to invade my right to peaceful enjoyment via your vile threats let this serve as my first legal notice of intent to make you cease and desist. You have violated your own terms of services and I will also use those avenues to ensure my quiet enjoyment of life if this continues.
Please do not respond to this email, you disturb my well being and quiet enjoyment.
This is to only serve as a legal notice.
Regards,
Mary X STXXXXXXXXXX
_______________________________________________________________________________________________
Don’t you just love those kids who throw rocks at your window and then RUN (we’ve all known at least one when we growing up), “growing up” is the operative word there…. it has a way of “hey I can say what I want to when I want to about you…. but…..” Oh wilted one, found that felony you were so worried about from the “other state” you used to live in and wondered back then if Red could find it and then use it to harass you, well has she???…
I will share what I want to and when I want to darlin, you took the member list and twisted it to your twisted sense of logic and did NOT know of what you spewth of ….
Sighs – blows on my finger nails and then buffs them again. Damn gardening can be dirty…
Now that the trash has been taken out think I will have another cup of coffee Ken always said if you get an email from Rose in the morning with or before the first cup of coffee you know what she really is thinking…….
From Dawna Kaufmann for release today:
My book, A Question of Murder, gives incontrovertible evidence from a panel of medical experts that Dr. Anna Maria Pou and two nurses at Memorial Medical Center in New Orleans “involuntarily euthanized” up to dozens of viable patients instead of evacuating them after Hurricane Katrina. Some of the patients were elderly, but not all of them.
The New York Times magazine is doing an 18 page piece on the matter — to run this Sunday or next.
My coauthor Dr. Cyril Wecht, along with Dr. Michael Baden, and others, did forensic and toxicology tests that proved Dr. Pou injected each patient with drugs intended to kill them — then left them, expecting their remains would decompose before they were recovered. CSI teams got to the bodies before that happened, which is why the testing was done.
Pou and the nurses were arrested, but due to the cowardice of the then-D.A. who never showed the Wecht reports to the grand jury, no charges were filed.
This case has never been reported to the degree I write about in our chapter five. I recount who at Tenet Healthcare gave Pou her marching orders and I name names. Now, four years later, most of the victims’ families have received settlements and Dr. Pou is treated in New Orleans as a pious person who did her best in a difficult situation. That’s a lie. While the hospital was flooded and without electricity in some parts, there was plenty of food and water. Some doctors walked away when they saw her begin her bedside murders; it would be better to abandon the patients than witness them being killed, they told me.
Anyone who has a loved one in a hospital or managed care should know this story.
OK folks I am off to watch the Kennedy coverage yes I confess I have been a Kennedy watcher and admirer since the 50’s.
I have been told or believe it to be true based on some emails between parties that some papers will be filed some time late this monring on the Texas case as well as I hope we begin to get the depos. unsealed in New York… Damn it I want to read them…
Talk to you later after the hearing if I find out how it went… my money is on that JW will get no traction, will be ordered for their client to turn over things and pave the way for a Contempt Motion, but that is just my bet on how today will go…
Rose [77] OMG is she trying to insinuate the only reason you get hits here is due to her
that is priceless. I loved the one claiming John’s article concerning the Manson Girl’s was his way of making fun of all of us, oh please 
the insanity of some I’m telling yah.
:edited by admin–corrected a misspelling:
#77 – Rose, do I dare ask “what in the hell is she talking about?” One of her former nic’s was M**y*t. Does this mean she can use that nic but you can’t. Guess I just don’t get it!!!! If you’d rather not answer that’s okay, certainly don’t want any more cases to follow. lol I didn’t realize she had taken a copy of the member list with her. How disloyal!!!!!!!!!!
In the past I’ve experienced being laid off and as a person who worked from home for a number of years I could have destroyed hundreds of business customer files. Instead, I made sure all the files were up to date, all items were filed, placed all folders in alphabetical order into boxes, provided computer files onto CD’s for the company owner as well as the sales personnel that managed the various accounts. Others have stolen from me but stealing from another isn’t part of my makeup. I can honestly say I’ve never taken anything that wasn’t mine.
I just feel (like it has been referred to before) that Craig Ball is aiding in the witch hunt for O’Quinn. What are they going to do with these thousands and thousands of documents? There are no definable limits set on what they can collect and the few that were originally set by the judge herself went by the wayside long ago.
How on earth is it right to allow this person to make copies of all data found or kept on a private computer(s) no matter what it’s relevance? Art purchased a computer in Alaska in early 2008 when he was interviewing Sarah Palin and he is supposed to just give the court all of that info just because it is on a computer he owns? How do we know for sure that this judge (who IMO invents her own laws) isn’t just handing copies of all of this stuff over to O’Quinn to go through and see if he can use something he finds to build his multiple cases up with? Maybe he can use things found to file new cases unrelated to this one?!
Get real, there has to be guidelines and limits in these situations! Florida was able to do it the right way with Stern’s computers. The used search parameters based on that case and only copied files/data that fit those parameters. Remember Ball said he couldn’t use the normal search names because Art either used a weird “Shorthand” or (ha-ha-ha) was just a lousy typist? How would he come to this conclusion unless he just opened files willy-nilly and noticed that? I understand exactly what is meant by “this case will won on appeals”. I don’t ever even want to drive through that state of Texas!
I do have a few questions for Dr. Wecht. He wrote that he wondered if Daniel had gotten up during the night and taken pills from the bag of medicine that Anna had in her room. I know about the one hospitalization that Larry Birkhead testified to where he saw a bag of meds in the room but I did not know it had been established that she had that bag with her when she gave birth to the baby. Was this something documented somewhere in the investigation? Also, was he aware (at the time of his writing) of the video in the CA house where Daniel was seen taking some meds that were Anna’s? The Topamax (sp?) is a curious thing to me. Did he ever find out if there ever was a legitimate reason for him to have taken it? i.e. was he prescribed it by any doctor for seizures or migraines? Was Topamax kept in Anna’s CA home? I just wonder how much and what kinds of meds Daniel might have taken from that house.
79 – Rose – I’m also watching all things related to Ted Kennedy.
Friday beginning at 6:00pm est MSNBC will have live coverage throughout the evening.
Saturday, MSNBC will begin their coverage at 10:00am est.
hmmm #46
I just saw your posting. Oh gosh, I can really commiserate with your ordeal! I lived nearly 2 years with no income (handouts and loans only) while waiting on my disability award. It is inhuman what some have to go through and the ones who have no resources are hit the hardest. I sincerely hope things are better for you now.
One thing to know about this “managed care” situation with physicians. Many physicians are given a set amount per patient/per year. The have to “budget” that amount and often that will be the deciding factor on whether a test is run or not (for example). On the other hand they can not put themselves in a position to be sued. Many people in their 90’s are very fraile and a surgery might just do them in. In my grandmother’s case she, as I said, could run circles around me and was incredibly active. By speaking out for her (she was very very ill) it was enough to tip the balance in favor of the surgery. My horror came in understanding that they were just going to let her die and say nothing to me or her!! Had I not said anything she would not have had the 6 years she lived beyond that time. She was an amazing woman!
77
OMG ROTFFLMAO
She is the one that used that moniker. Her new friends are the ones that let her identity out. What, they can talk about you and put false information out about you but you can’t answer them? They even use you given name to piss you off. OMG! What’s the saying they use there so frequently? Oh yea, POT MEET KETTLE.
82
I finished reading the ANS chapter last night and Dr. Wecht says that he doesn’t know where Daniel got the Topamax from but that ANS had a script for it for her seizures. Also we find out that ANS did truly have seizures. A cyst was found on the back of her brain during autopsy but had nothing to do with her death.
The In Regards to Weekly Homes: decision by the Supreme Court of Texas has been issued the one that everyone has been waiting for because it is the first time the Texas Supreme Court has finally addressed electronic discovery. I have not read it but here is the link for all of you that want to read it now.
http://www.supreme.courts.state.tx.us/historical/2009/aug/080836.htm
First part I have read says this:
we hold that the trial court abused its discretion.
Roxanne [85] her new friends are the ones who took her moniker and turn it into standing for a sexually transmitted disease.
#85 Not to mention if you go back and pull the subpoenas or my Agreed Motion or anything connected to a filing for info. Maryst is ONE of the many search terms connected with her…. sssoooooooooooooooooo??????
Rose [89] isn’t the “maryst” moniker on the list of 40?
Damn we all were having great discussions yesterday and none of it had to do with M**y or the Red Dog and you know it had to be eating at them that we were not turning our focus on them.
My point is and this just being my opinion of course but Rose that is probably why you received that e-mail.
JMA [90] Among other alias’ of her’s.
JMA [91] not to mention it’s name coming up on google. Rose tries not to give her the attention until and unless she sends out one of her dimwitted emails like she did.
Oops, meant to add to my last post that it had nothing to do with you addressing what the dynamic duo diggers who come up with zilch were posting over at the cesspool yesterday. Again, this of course is just my opinion ;-)
August 28, 2009 Plaintiff Virgie Arthur’s Response to Art Harris Motion to Reconsider the Appointment of Craig Ball with a Request for Protective Order and Stay in the forensic exam of his electronic media.
http://www.rosespeaks.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&op=getit&lid=2369
Just got this right before Court is to start today, I have not read it yet.
Ken [93] I know I have noticed that Rose does not respond to the bullshit that is posted over at the cesspool, ha-ha she has more patience then me for sure. Any woo you would think those people [at the cesspool] would take the almost never or very few responses as a sign that the person they are seeking the attention of is not paying attention and realize what a waste of time. Oops, well unless it’s really about being excepted in the “Mean Girl’s Club”
JMA [96] that’s the response any sane, logical thinking person would have, but these people believe that no response is an affirmation of their (false) accusations and uses it as proof that they are right. But what do you expect from a pack of jackals who would eat their own young if they showed any weakness (in their eyes)
Hey what did I misspell in my post #80? I just noticed it was “:edited by admin–corrected a misspelling:” my bad :-( Oh well at least I wasn’t sent to timeout no service in there
Rose #95..I can’t open the latest filing..get an error message..something like THis is not a #PDF file
okay, I fixed the bad link to the latest filing. Thanks to the CyberAngel out there that brought it to our attention. You know who you are ;-) (it was sent to us b4 Trailblazer posted)
JMA [97] You misspelt Manson, instead said Mason
It’s now fixed, y’all. You can try to dl it again
May 2009 Texas Appellate Decision of Designation of Responsible Third Parties is NOT wrong and in fact should and can be used to avoid the statute of limitations.
http://www.rosespeaks.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&op=getit&lid=2370
Remember how here we practice the let Google be your friend, hard to believe I found this but neither McCabe nor Babcock found it oh well shows what a tad of research from one’s home computer can do…
Thanks Ken
And what kind of leverage did Ms. Contary think she would acquire with the member list? To be welcomed into the fold or was she always?
*Ms. Contrary*
Ken [101] oh OK thanks for correcting that for me sometimes my fingers seem to stray he-he gotta blame something.
77-”legal notice”? LOL LOL Well you could email that person back and SERVE A LEGAL NOTICE ON HER FOR TRASHING YOU AND YOUR HUSBAND’S NAME DAILY, OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AT TOPIX. FOR TRASHING YOUR MEMBER’S NAMES DAILY OVER AND OVER.
WHAT A LOONEY TUNE, ST – ST – ST, LOL THAT *ST* IS ON THAT LIST OF 40, THAT EVERYONE HAS!!! KOOK A DOODLE DOO!
IF SHE TOOK THAT MEMBER LIST, IT IS THEFT!
SOMEONE PLEASE CALL THE POLICE! LOL LOL
HEY FRUIT CAKE! YOU DISTURB PEOPLE FROM THIS SITE’S WELL BEING WITH YOUR LIES AND DIRECT INSULTS BY EACH OF OUR NAMES DAILY!!
YOUR CRAZY NUTSO ACTIONS DISTURB ALL OF OUR QUIET ENJOYMENT EVERY DAY!!!
This is to only serve as a legal notice.
Regards,
ALL OF THE PEOPLE YOU PERSONALLY PICK ON DAILY.
ALL OF THE PEOPLE YOU FALSELY ACCUSE ON OTHER SITES DAILY.
ALL OF THE PEOPLE YOU LIE ABOUT DAILY.
ALL OF THE PEOPLE WHO WANT TO PUKE AT EACH ONE OF YOUR STUPID QUESTIONS.
ALL OF THE PEOPLE WHO ARE DAMN GLAD YOU ARE THERE AND NOT HERE!
LOL LOL LOL
WHAT A NUT!
ST- IF YOU WANT *QUIET* –YOU NEED TO QUIT USING THE FULL MONIKERS FROM HERE AND USE INITIALS
THIS IS MY AND PROBABLY A BUNCH OF OTHERS LEGAL DAMN NOTICE TO YOU! LOL Should quit spiking that kool-aid, ya think?
LOL-To [108] Bravo {{{clapping}}} and though I know you were trying to be serious, I love the humor you used while getting the message across.
I guess I am lost here how could any of you conspired to make VA look bad? All the stories that that I read were true or in one case true after the fact and that one none of you wrote from what I have gathered,.I agree with Roxie Ball says he will never work for a defendent and that does make him biased as for Mc IMO he should have been disbarrred when he was teaching and had his row with the young college women,He is lucky he wasn’t IMO So he has nothing to complain about especially after he tried to go after Lin Woods. The big cry babyMC that is not Lin woods
Well I lost it on: When Irish Eyes are Smiling…
What a beautiful tribute to Sen. Kennedy!
R.I.P.
_____________
A sad note:
O/T:
“DJ AM Dies
Posted Aug 28th 2009 7:05PM by TMZ Staff
UPDATE: A rep for DJ AM just issued the following statement: “Adam “DJ AM” Goldstein was found deceased this afternoon in his New York City apartment. The circumstances surrounding his death are unclear. Out of respect for his family and loved ones, please respect their privacy at this time.”
Law enforcement sources tell us DJ AM — also known as Adam Goldstein — was found dead this afternoon in New York City.”
Beth I laughed and I cried… it was the perfect Irish Wake… he was their anchor in planning even this for them… Wow so much to take in about him that I had thought I knew but now ….. Orin Hatch gave a beautiful eulogy
I laughed and cried as well. Just beautiful, so fitting for an accomplished man of faith and service to our country. R.I.P. Teddy, you will be missed.
Any information from court?
Yes Sammy I do hwve the tentative decision from the Court pending the Court signing an Order next week
1. The Special Master stays
2. Because of the volume of emails to go through (several thousand like LH had) AH gets 30 days instead of the 14 in the original Order
3. AH Does NOT have to turn over any other computers, media etc. at this time, major win for AH IMO on that one
4. AH Does HAVE TO ANSWER the Special Master’s questions as presented to his counsel in emails
5. AH has to preserve all media including that which the Special Master asked about
On a side note I “think” that Ken and my hard drives will me imaged next week probably sent out noon of the 3rd, have it imaged on the 4 and back to us by noon on the 5th… that could change pending on the holiday next weekend.
Just got here and #68 trina I hope that you are not that kind of poster because if you are that shows a narrow mind and here all anyone and especially Rose and Ken have said is ask questions and discuss the cases, but I find offense when someone comes to someone’s house and shits on the floor, Alot of the posters from Topix are not house trained and hit and run, You know that. From my understanding here is a place that all opinions are welcome but alot—All anyone here is wanting is to see it real and fair and the court of law unbiased and just for all, Plaintiff and defendants, Let me ask you this do you see how this Judge is fair and ruling on motions from the defence or even considering or just plaintiff???, If you think both sides please point those out because I have not… A real or normal Judge imo is balanced and considers all sides before he/she rules and sites case law or has something to back up how he/she came to the decision he/she did and does not refer to motions from the defence as inches and does not use counsel’s papers to follow along, Can any explain how this is just??. That is why I think the only way to have fair and balanced (which Judges are supposed to do) is the appellate court because that is their Job! and by this Judge’s own words and the court record she is not imo.
Ken you said it perfect!!!!– #71, Ken says:
August 28, 2009 at 8:10 am
trina [68] The comments about this case being won on appeals, not at trial, are because off the judge we’re up in front of and how everything she rules is in McC’s favor. If you look at everything she’s ruled on, how she’s given everything to him that he’s wanted, denied or just refused to hear anything by the defendants, the logical conclusion is that McC basically has this thing won, in her court. (bold for emphasis on just her court) As you know from following this case, the judge doesn’t follow the law (heck, she has to ask McC at times what the law is and what she has the authority to do, ie jailing people), she ignores or just completely disregards/tosses out rulings by higher courts, makes ‘I said so’ rulings (see Dec 11 transcript). With all that, do you think the defendants have a snowballs chance in hell of winning in front of her? (even if it’s a jury trial, she can over rule the jury’s decision and rule in favor of McC, which I have no doubt she would do)
As for the stuff going on behind the scenes, anybody with common sense should know that the public is not getting the full picture of this case (due to things going on that the public are not privy to nor can be revealed, for the time being) yet there seems to be a lack of that common sense and it seems a whole lot of people are taking the little bit that they are allowed to see as being the whole picture and making accusations (most false) and threats against us. It’s like they read the front and back cover and the inside cover of the book and believe they know what the whole book is about.
Thank you Ken!.
Oh crap I just got to #77, I am laughing so hard, she does not want to be referred to as her full name, lol
oh maybe I should refer to her as what her friends call her Mary STD maybe she prefers that.. What a nut job, Can’t fix crazy, ( I know, I do pity but wth?) she just makes me think that she is in dire need for attention and a intervention by her family, Someone please help this woman!
“1046. In the Cosby case today – 8/28/09, Doc# 141
PLAINTIFF HOWARD K. STERN’S MEMORANDUM IN OPPOSITION TO DEFENDANT COSBY’S LIMITED MOTION FOR RECONSIDERATION
As we recall, Cosby moved that Judge Chin reconsider having Statements 1 and 2 (among others) go to the Jury in her defamation trial because Chin had written in his opinion that allegations of homosexuality are not libel per se. The two statements refer to the allegation of HKS and LB having sex at a party that was witnessed by Jackie Hatten and ANS and to the existence of a sex tape of the two that ANS would watch sometimes in view of her household staff. Cosby contends special damages have not been claimed – HKS points out Cosby didn’t brief on that issue and ask for summary judgement regarding special damages before Judge Chin ruled; and so the issue is argued.
HKS makes two points. Firstly, that Lin Wood misspoke when in oral arguments he said there were no special damages alleged due to the Statements 1 & 2. In fact, if it was necessary to argue the point, HKS could show a Doctor’s visit and its costs directly related to the impact of those two statements. However, the more detailed memo of law that follows argues that having to show special damages isn’t necessary in the Cosby case.
So secondly, HKS makes a detailed distinction between libels per se and per quod. In the latter case, the statements may seem innocuous on the face of it but extrinsic facts (in this instance, knowledge people have not gained from reading the book rather hold as a course of their life experiences) could lead Jurors to conclude that the non-libelous accusation of ‘being gay’ is in fact libelous in the way the book presented it. This is what Judge Chin wrote in his opinion and that type of libel requires special damages to be proved.
But HKS is saying that the statements 1 & 2 do not exist as individual allegations. Instead, those two statements are the gist of Cosby’s book: the gay lovers concocted a murder for profit scheme and HKS was able to keep LB in line because of the taboo nature of the secret they both held. HKS quotes the attributed JH and VA parts of the book with their individual allegations of, respectively, HKS/LB having had sex and then LB essentially being black-mailed because of it.
The basic position of HKS from day one is re-stated again which is that he contends the entire book is libelous, and the individual statements as listed in the lawsuit are not be construed alone. In the context of the entire book, the Statements 1 & 2 are defamatory on the face of it (libel per se) when you read them as part of the entire book, since they represent the gist of the book and are referenced in many other sections as the story goes on. HKS urges Judge Chin not to deal with them as individual statements as Cosby is urging now, which would be a consideration of libel per quod and would require a showing of special damages.
Judge Chin himself has basically argued favorably for HKS on this issue already in his opinion. Chin noted that although the issue of special damages was not brought up by EITHER party before he ruled, the lawsuit itself says the entire book is defamatory and $60 million in damages are being sought.
Posted at 11:50PM on Aug 28th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean”
Beth [111] OMG I just read that this morning [DJ AM] it is sad but at the same time due to what they found it’s kinda F’d up. Why? Here was a guy who got a second chance at life after the plane crash in 2008 and now because he chose crack of all things is now gone. The reason I only say the crack is most likely the pain med’s were due to his injury [I’m speculating] after the plane crash. I remember he and Travis Barker were really messed up after the crash.
Oh by the way was reading over at the cesspool today and the RAT’S think the poster “LOL-To *ST*” is you, matter of fact they say [thinking it’s you] you are acting like a 12 year old and seem to have anger issues. OMG WTH do they wear blinder while posting over there, I can name 3 from over there that have serious anger issues and crap two of them occasionally attack each other.
JMA,
Morning, yes that is sad about DJ AM.
Funny about them isn’t it? I wonder if they saw the post about ’her’ email to someone from here? The “cease and desist” one?
Most likely that post did not stop her from singling out others by name and putting them down I bet!
I assume she still has that narcissistic; ‘me, me, me’ complex… Oh well, just chalk that up to some sort of deep seeded problems I guess. Probably best to ignore instead of feeding them the attention they so seem to crave. Sad, that kind of illness is very sad.
Crazy, it is just crazy! On this site there are other topics and threads with a multitude of cases and subjects…
WTH are they going to do when HKS and the Doctor’s do not get ‘what they think they will in CA’? (or) when this ‘mock’ of a case in TX is done? (or) when SC, GA, NY, and LB’s business w/ Opri, ect… is completely finished?
Are those people going to be putting the site owner here or her members down for the other opinions on different subjects too? Do they NOT HAVE A LIFE outside of falsely accusing others of things who they do not know?
I do not think they will have a place to go in the near future, so they can continue to put people down, take our monikers and post crap like it came from us all they want… They are almost finished with the ANS saga IMO. I personally cannot wait until everything is finished in all of the ANS cases! When the Marshall case is finished, then maybe the TX agenda will subside.
The funny thing is, or the last time I looked the VAS seem to even be turning on themselves.
It is not so much whose side you support, with them it is how much ‘tension’ can they cause with the people who are posting with them or on other boards.
I have never seen so much accusing of others in my life! I have never seen adults act like uneducated bullies with absolutely no class at all!
It is crazy, and I wish they would just act on the web like they do in society. God forbid if they act like that with their family members or people they actually see face to face!
Well, take it easy JMA, and have a good week-end.
The funeral for Senator Kennedy was just beautiful!
What great words for this man!
I know I am a bit out of the loop here, but who in the heck is “MaryST or Mary STD”? (I do not follow those other sites). Is ST her real last name? (I wouldn’t think so) and why would I know who she was by seeing “Mary ST”?
I have only this time or inclination to read at this site, which I like very much, so if she thinks I know who she is my that acronym, she’s nuts! I go by Noni96 at some other places, NO YOU KNOW WHO I AM by that????
I just started reading the Mandamus ruling re: the Supreme Court of Texas and just LOVED the first paragraph:
“In this mandamus proceeding, we must decide whether the trial court abused its discretion by ordering four of the defendant’s employees to turn over their computer hard drives to forensic experts for imaging, copying, and searching for deleted emails. Because the plaintiff failed to demonstrate the particular characteristics of the electronic storage devices involved, the familiarity of its experts with those characteristics, or a reasonable likelihood that the proposed search methodology would yield the information sought, and considering the highly intrusive nature of computer storage search and the sensitivity of the subject matter, we hold that the trial court abused its discretion.
”
Yes, Yes, yes! Can this be sited now in the cases before Judge Lindsey? I sure hope so. Common sense tells me she is horribly abusing her powers.
Beth [120] well you know it will be the same old drill if none of these suits turn out the way they want them, they will scream corruption and or bribery. I’m with you, I cannot wait until all is said and done, and yes where will they go from there and what group of people will be their targets. Yes, their alliance with other VAS seems to be wearing thin and in a way, it is hilarious it’s like watching the battle of the bullies.
Beth, you have a great weekend too.
Noni [121] in reference to “but who in the heck is “MaryST or Mary STD?” no one of importance but their wanting so badly to be.
Noni I sure hope so..judge Lindsay IMO did abuse her powers as a judge especially by asking the plaintiffs attorney what should I do now or how ever it was worded.But it seems lindsay doesn’t care to readanything that might go against the plaintiffs.JMO
What a beautiful celebration of life for Teddy. I’m sitting here crying for his family, those who love him and for all those he has helped in his lifetime. Go in peace, Teddy.
Beth, Liann – please read pg 63 you know where.
Beth, Liann – correction – pg 72 sorry about that. Memory is going in my old age.
Noni
MaryST is our old moderator Daisy. She has posted under different names at different times. SHE choose the MaryST to post here and on Topix at one time. The people she post with on Topix are the one’s who outed what her real name is. From what I am told, Mary post daily about Rose over on Topix. It’s non stop Rose hate fest for Mary. Rose had some court stuff over 10 years ago and Red posted some crap from it and said that Rose had court coming up soon on that stuff which is just bullshit and Mary took that and ran with it, once again not doing any reading or research FOR HERSELF but going solely by what someone else TOLD HER. Make a long story short….. it’s not true. Rose decided to answer Mary and Red on this blog and then she got the ridiculous email from Mary. Here’s the thing. Mary hits and runs. She will send out emails to people then block their email address so they can’t answer her. LOL Basically it’s more stupid bullshit. See post number 77 for a look at Mary’s email to Rose and her answer back.
Roxanne [128] speaking of the e-mail Rose received, my post #91 was taken from here and now is being responded to over at the cesspool. She is claiming that since Rose has put up her supposed “legal notice” on the site it prevents anyone from here using her name
Hey Rose if you put a notice here in the site saying something like, THIS IS “A LEGAL NOTICE”…DO NOT STEAL MEMBERS POST AND PASTE THEM ELSEWHERE can that legally stop M**y from stealing my posts from here
This is for M**y~~ how am I arrogant due to believing it ate at you all the other day cause you were not topic of our conversation? Apparently, it did eat at you because you are commenting on my post from yesterday. Not sure, how you get by me speaking my opinion was me wanting self-importance
You are the one who has the wannbe “important” issue not me. Ah do not worry about what comes out of my mouth, last I looked you were not listed as my mother on my birth certificate. Oh and what I write on the blog at Rose Speaks does not come out of my mouth, it comes off my fingertips.
Since it seems anyone can write a legal notice here is my LEGAL NOTICE to you M**y…DO NOT MAKE ME TOPIC OF YOUR CONVERSATION OVER THERE!
She post under the name Mary and when and if I refer to her I will call her Mary. What’s the big deal? She would be hard pressed in a lawsuit to prove she was damaged by anyone here using her name’s that SHE CHOOSE TO POST UNDER. It wasn’t any one of us who outed what her first and last name was. I had no idea what her last name was until she became a mod here and we started first communicating using email. Her last name was part of her email but I have never used her last name in anything I have ever said. What she needs to be threating to sue for is that derogatory name that was given to her and picked up by most of the VA supporters but go figure.
If a legal notice can be given on a website then here’s mine….
LEGAL NOTICE TO MARY. LEAVE ME OUT OF YOUR SHIT. I HAVE NEVER DONE A DAMN THING TO YOU. QUIT HAVING A GO AT ME AND I, IN RETURN, WOULD HAVE NO REASON TO ANSWER YOU BACK ON THINGS.
What am I supposed to put in here next…. oh yea
CEASE AND DESIST MARY.
Is that how it’s supposed to go?
Hi Sammy!, I just got on tonight, I went to look and there is alot so I guess I will just re-post Swims and stuff and I am reading from the last comment up here and there, I hope to catch up with you all tomorrow.
Shout out to you all and I hope everyone is well!
Rox That was excellent wording. I am not sure if she is in dire need of attention or what??. STOP AND DESIST MARY!, Know this Mary attention warranted is not always attention wanted! and you will find yourself with Unwanted Attention!
1070. 1048. 1046. In the Cosby case today – 8/28/09, Doc# 141
Swims. Thank goodness they corrected that misspeak, and thank you for posting it here. Reading your posts are always good reading.
Posted at 12:10AM on Aug 29th 2009 by true confessions
*****
Thank you true confessions. I suppose these things happen in oral arguments when an Attorney who has ‘written’ his legal views so many times over and over and always consistently overlooks restating ‘verbally’ one fine point that the opposition later seizes upon with new argument for the Court to consider.
It’s an awfully fine point. Cosby says if ‘gay’ is not libel per se, then any statement with ‘gay’ in it should be tossed out. HKS of course reiterates for the umpteenth time that Cosby’s statements are hardly just a casual reference to his sexuality.
Posted at 7:18PM on Aug 29th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/07/20/larry-b-and-dannielynn-swingers/72#comments#ixzz0Pdq8×974
1077. 1067. 991.
It really serves no purpose I would think constantly rehashing old untruths about the stolen property from ‘Horizons’ when Court docs are publicly available that confirm what pro-HKS posters have been commenting since FS did the deed back in February, 2007.
Posted at 6:15PM on Aug 27th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
************
I highly suggest that reading the partial deposition of FS and BT
might give these people an insight into what is really occuring in the SC case. Although I have never had respect for those two who stole Anna’s property, I felt that perhaps there is a tad of hope for rehabilitation after reading FS opinion regarding the Texas cabal. Quote: “I learned to stay away from those people”.
Posted at 4:23PM on Aug 29th 2009 by silkwood
*****
I agree. It’s stunning to what extent Susan Brown entangled FS/G. Ben with the TX cabal against the wishes of her then clients. The O’Q people have taken down so many people into the gutter then abandoned them as the facts come out.
Posted at 8:22PM on Aug 29th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/07/20/larry-b-and-dannielynn-swingers/72#comments#ixzz0PdrIUXGY
1078.
I wonder what his ‘line’ will be if he is added as a Defendant in the civil conspiracy lawsuit against FS/G. Ben and is no longer able to be the lead attorney in the vexatious ‘bloggers’ lawsuit?
News to McCabe: VA’s Splash Agent arranged for her to put the ’stories’ into the mainstream media; stories that were fabricated by members of, employees of, or those ‘known’ to the O’Q Law Firm.
Posted at 7:31PM on Aug 23rd 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/07/20/larry-b-and-dannielynn-swingers/51#comments#ixzz0Pcac5xKS
If McCabe is added as a defendant to another lawsuit by one of the defendants in VA’s case, he can no longer represent VA?
Posted at 8:27PM on Aug 29th 2009 by Just Asking
Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/07/20/larry-b-and-dannielynn-swingers/72#comments#ixzz0PdrmcYHN
1079. …
I personally think the real reason she wants statements #1 and #2 dropped from the trial is because she cannot back them up at all. These two statements were the sensationalistic ‘previously unreported’ selling point for Hatchette, as per Amy Einhorn affidavit and docs/exhibits. Even the judge stated as much in his ruling.
JH and VA were the only sources for the second statement I think about the sex tape in context (as you have stated) with the motive for ‘blackmailing’ Larry to ‘let’s make a deal’ scenario. We know Larry explained all that thoroughly in his affidavit and denounced it as baloney.
So the statements are intertwined and comprise the thesis of the book; just as the conspiracy to defame VA is alleged to have destroyed VA’s custody suit in The Bahamas due to the TMZ blog article about the stepbrother story. EXCEPT, the book lays it all out IN PRINT and is bs and the only thing laid out is the blogger case is blogger emails from ONE PARTY (only authenticated ones) that talk about everything BUT the TMZ article other than to name QV, J Devin and others as DISCUSSING it.
Proving that the TMZ article cost VA custody in the Bahamas is so ludicrous that the entire case falls apart before it ever begins. The ‘discovery’ phase that has been extended so long has proven NOTHING of merit to the allegations against all of the defendants.
But, I digress–the blogger case is so idiotic and the machinations of McCabe so convoluted and peripheral to the meat of the alleged case–I didn’t bother to read any of it until this morning with the refreshing light of day.
BTW Tropical Storm Danny brushed past me late last night and we had some booming thunder which scared my little dog and I slept through it. Today the sun is shining and the sky is cobalt blue.
Posted at 10:12AM on Aug 29th 2009 by My take
*****
Yes, Cosby is desperate to get Statements 1 & 2 out because then she could avoid confronting ‘nannygate’ in Court to a greater extent. ‘Nannygate’ is all any Jury would need to hear about to determine the key ‘actual malice’ as well as a consciousness of guilt. The whole episode of attempting to buy false testimony to save her butt in a civil trial offends society.
And speaking of offensive, the ‘bloggers’ case is a fraud in its every single word. In Federal Court in the same city VA confessed the truth of having not been defamed and in fact having made up her allegations about HKS and others. McCabe confessed the ’step-brother’ story was substantially if not literally true as it was written. To then go to State Court in Houston and claim that most people are too stupid to understand plain English in an entertainment site’s story is beyond the pale. The ‘bloggers’ case could only be and WAS brought before the Supreme Court in Nassau, The Bahamas and rejected on the face of it.
Posted at 9:08PM on Aug 29th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/07/20/larry-b-and-dannielynn-swingers/72#comments#ixzz0PdsKylG1
1080. 1063. (1) charging the plaintiff with a serious crime; (2) that tend to injure another in his or her trade, business or profession;3 (3) that plaintiff has a loathsome disease; or (4) imputing unchastity to a woman.” Liberman, 80 N.Y.2d at 435 (internal formatting omitted). Statements that fall within one of these four exceptions are deemed slanderous per se and do not require the plaintiff to prove special damages.
Footnote #3 3 Stern contends that Statements 1 and 2 are defamatory in that they do injure him in his or her trade, business or profession. Alleging that Stern, Ms. Smith’s lawyer, engaged in a sexual relationship with Ms. Smith’s boyfriend while representing Ms. Smith tends to injure his professional reputation as a lawyer.
Although under slander rules the majority slanderous statements require proof of special damages, libelous statements receive a significantly different treatment.
(well, you get the drift here, I think)…Wood is presenting detailed arguments replete with a great deal of case law, technicall ‘challenging’ the court (I think) on these technical legal definitions regarding slander and the exceptions for special damages; regarding slander as libel with different criteria and I’m taking a break now. :-)
Posted at 11:59AM on Aug 29th 2009 by My take
*****
After Cosby’s stunning defeat McNamara throws a hail Mary pass. Wood is forced into an odd situation where he must seek a correction/clarification of the Court’s language even though Judge Chin is clearly siding with HKS. I agree it is relatively dry reading especially after the page-turner Judge Chin himself produced!
“(1) charging the plaintiff with a serious crime; (2) that tend to injure another in his or her trade, business or profession;” = a summary of the O’Q/VA bloggers accusations from day one that still persist.
Posted at 9:08PM on Aug 29th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/07/20/larry-b-and-dannielynn-swingers/72#comments#ixzz0PdslvGDD
1082. 1079.
I wonder what his ‘line’ will be if he is added as a Defendant in the civil conspiracy lawsuit against FS/G. Ben and is no longer able to be the lead attorney in the vexatious ‘bloggers’ lawsuit?
News to McCabe: VA’s Splash Agent arranged for her to put the ’stories’ into the mainstream media; stories that were fabricated by members of, employees of, or those ‘known’ to the O’Q Law Firm.
Posted at 7:31PM on Aug 23rd 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
If McCabe is added as a defendant to another lawsuit by one of the defendants in VA’s case, he can no longer represent VA?
Posted at 8:27PM on Aug 29th 2009 by Just Asking
*****
In a practical sense it would be difficult to do. Just as O’Q didn’t serve as the lead Attorney for the ‘Mommie Dearest’ then ‘bloggers’ cases because he was at the time an alleged defamer himself in HKS’s FL litigation.
The ‘bloggers’ case has always suffered from the fact that the O’Q Law Firm is handling it. VA undercuts the heart of the lawsuits in her federal court deposition and McCabe much later opines that VA couldn’t be expected to know the details of her own cases anyway. So the question constantly pops up for good reason: who is the actual plaintiff in VA’s past and present lawsuits?
So if McCabe is named in the SC case as a defendant in a real conspiracy testified to in depositions by the actual people involved in it (no emails or mystery people in sight) then he would sound and look odd continuing to argue his fantasy conspiracy created by his own bloggers of a group of people who came together allegedly to do something that never happened and wasn’t necessary anyway.
Posted at 9:33PM on Aug 29th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
1083. …
To the extent Cosby’s Motion is a new argument that could have been advanced at summary judgment, Cosby’s Motion should be denied.
Posted at 9:30PM on Aug 29th 2009 by My take
*****
Yes, Cosby is parsing the Judge’s own words in a new argument that suggests frankly that Chin didn’t understand the effect of his own Opinion. It’s awfully bold for Cosby to suggest to the Judge that he didn’t grasp fully what he had just written.
I think Judge Chin went to great lengths to be clear that he thought just the allegation of being gay, even when untrue, is not defamatory on the face of it in this day and age, BUT that a Jury could find that the use of the allegation in the context of Cosby’s book was. Cosby/McNamara know this. Cosby suggesting she didn’t get the point of the entire stunning Opinion and wants a second bite at the apple in a limited way is just at this stage of the lawsuit trying the patience of the Court I would think.
Posted at 9:46PM on Aug 29th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/07/20/larry-b-and-dannielynn-swingers/73#comments#ixzz0PdtGgSBG
1086. 1085. Posted at 9:46PM on Aug 29th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
Well, I just looked up P. 30, n. 12 (the footnote) in which Judge Chin stated that neither party (Hatchette and Cosby) had moved on special damages in the Motion for SJ. He goes on to say that HKS had made it to the jury and a plaintiff can go to jury for as little as $1 to show he was libeled. Just paraphrasing–but I think it is an important point.
I think the fact that she is moving NOW, AFTER THE FACT, is not necessarily challenging the judge, but a last ditch effort to throw out those two damaging statements. Remember, she always had the ‘gay is ok’ thing going, PLUS Lambda which Judge Chin agreed with. Perhaps she thinks the judge was wavering–of course he isn’t.
As far as nannygate, well VA is the only available witness (source) for the 2nd statement, according to Cosby. Yes, I agree, any veering into nannygate (and Wood will find a way, no doubt) will kill off the case. Cosby will be sunk by the jury–they will be totally disgusted with her at mention of nannygate.
Posted at 9:54PM on Aug 29th 2009 by My take
*****
Yes, even for $1 HKS deserves to be ‘vindicated’ by the Jury.
I first commented after Cosby’s latest Motion that she was making what were new arguments for her but which had been made by Judge Chin with himself as it were as he wrote his Opinion and covered those bases.
It’s clear that Judge Chin wants Statements 1 & 2 to go to the Jury. After all, he ordered an emergency deposition of Cosby when ‘nannygate’ broke to immortalize the details when the dirty deed was fresh.
Posted at 11:08PM on Aug 29th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/07/20/larry-b-and-dannielynn-swingers/73#comments#ixzz0PdtrIJDs
1088. Cosby has effectively shut down public release of the depositions–her own–with this garbage motion.
We know from this there are at least 235 pages in her deposition–and we believe it is 400 pages from what was said in Nov. 2007 when she wanted it sealed.
I suppose Wilma could be a witness for statement #2 or Don Clark–for Rita. LOL.
Posted at 10:16PM on Aug 29th 2009 by My take
*****
LOL. As Judge Chin wrote, it’s evidence of actual malice to have relied upon any word spoken by Clark or Wilma (or VA or JH).
Yes, the world awaits the exposure of the evil-doers (their depos and docs) and Cosby is bothering the Court and nit-picking about statements she knows are going to a Jury unless she comes to her senses.
McNamara is cranking up the legal fees before the settlement and/or Cosby feels she is such a ’star’ that she could pull if off in front of a NYC Jury and/or the both of them are still receiving ‘tips’ from the TX cabal; ‘confidentiality’ has allowed McCabe to perpetrate the ‘bloggers’ lawsuit to a great extent.
The depos alone will make great reading in Court rooms (and Prosecutors’ Offices)in several States.
Posted at 12:06AM on Aug 30th 2009 by Only swim in the Ocean
Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/07/20/larry-b-and-dannielynn-swingers/73#comments#ixzz0PduIB4PU
Thank You Swims and etc for the intelligent and most thought provoking posts!!!!!!, Thank you again!
Oops I forgot the memo, Swims used the W word
, #140 – 1088 is the best!, it is moderation I forgot W!lma’s name is not to be said in full, Whatever, What a joke she is trying for some reason to not have her name out there, 
as if!, OWN IT B!TCH! What are you ashamed of????. Own yourself and be proud! What is that all about ;lol: Stand by your convictions, What are you hiding??., I say own it, I own my words, has the tide turned and you are no longer protected? are you just a private person now?, No, that will never hold uo, 
imo.
Wi!ma V1ce you with full knowledge put yourself into this saga in every aspect, Own it and stop making excuses and save your dignity, The truth always comes to light no matter how long one stalls. I think you should just bow out graceful because you are being made to be the patsy and has been put to posture imo.
LIann uhmmmm…not sure where you are posting at before you come here, but yer doing it again. look at posts 132 & 133
Goodmorning.
Thanks for the posts Liann, great, great reading!
Ken, maybe she has that software my oldestest daughter has? Where when you ‘go to’ type your moniker/name, after you type the first letter it fills it in for you? [ the computer's memory and all...
] Could be the other letter is used on something else, like my Amazon and Netflex are different then here…
Point is, it might not be posting anywhere else, could just be an order site or something.
* I feel like ‘problem solving’ today! ;)
Wish I could fix all of the problems I have and this stupid TX State case too for all of the Defendants! :D
Beth [145] Most browsers will do autofill for you (they remember stuff you’ve typed in and like you said, when you start typing, it fills it in). My post to her was more in fun and jest (due to an earlier convo on another thread) than actually meaning anything serious. (I was also typing before 1st cup of coffee)
Oh yes I know… Hope I was not mis-understood. I remember that conversation from the other thread.
Well, maybe to some…. ;)
Sorry, I DID KNOW it WAS NOT a ‘serious’ thing. I bet is sucks big time to have to be on-guard with how your words will be taken! I will try to be more cautious on how I word mine so, you do not feel as though it was me being trying to be a smart ass or something! ;) LOL I do not think I am very good at being one of those!
Speaking of coffee, I ran out yesterday. Tea is just not getting it for me this morning! I am craving something strong from Starbucks!
I just heard more on TV about this story just now. Wow, talk about crazy! His wife was shown as being upset she was being incarcerated (shown in court in that orange prison garb) Too bad, what monsters they BOTH are!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1209966/Jaycee-Lee-Dugards-prison-First-pictures-filthy-backyard-jail-religious-fanatic-held-kidnapped-girl.html
Jaycee Lee Dugard’s prison: First pictures of filthy backyard jail where religious fanatic held kidnapped girl
By Sharon Churcher In Antioch, California and Peter Sheridan In Los Angeles
Last updated at 2:13 PM on 30th August 2009
Roxanne [130] apparently it was a slow night over there and that is why my post were taken and responded to, it’s crazy.
OH NO I did not add the CEASE AND DESIST to my legal notice [129] does that mean it is not legally binding
Liann ~~ reading all the Swims post reminded me of something. Where are those Depositions? Thanks for bringing those posts here so all can read what appears to be a very informative individual ;-)
Liann [142] Amen Sista ;-) she put herself/name out there so now what every she discusses/discussed on public forums she’s gonna have to own it.
148
Beth [147] OMG no coffee, I would be having caffeine withdraw.
Beth [147] I thought you might have misunderstood my (pre-coffee) attempt at humor, but knowing now that you are coffee deprived (I can find a picture of a cup of coffee and send it to you if that would help
) explains a lot. I know here, if we were out of coffee, it would be…well, lets just say not pleasant 
.
JMA & Ken, LOL Yes! I am getting ready to go get some! I love my coffee, day and night!
Rox, great post yesterday!
JMA [150] I believe that by RC filing the Motion for Chin to ‘RECONSIDER’ #1 and #2 > it has PUT A HALT on the releasing for now.
I.E. This is another observation #140 (this page)
“1088. Cosby has effectively shut down public release of the depositions–her own–with this garbage motion.
We know from this there are at least 235 pages in her deposition–and we believe it is 400 pages from what was said in Nov. 2007 when she wanted it sealed.
I suppose Wilma could be a witness for statement #2 or Don Clark–for Rita. LOL. Posted at 10:16PM on Aug 29th 2009 by My take”
WHEN those depositions do come out! I hope it BLOWS CA, SC, GA, and this TX State case wide open! I hope it exposes the REAL CONSPIRATORS!
icma, donny boy, quinny, cabey/scabey, even va should be brought up on conspiracy charges IMO. Enough is Enough! They have manipulated and colluded with Susan Brown, many different Justice Departments, their actions HAVE TO BE EXPOSED! Just because they are in the LEGAL field DOES NOT MEAN THEY ARE EXCEMPT
GET THE REAL CULPRITS, and the unethical people who are ill
Oh NO! I have been spammed!
LOL I even tried to use different names… maybe it was in the post I reposted…
Well, I am off for a bit! Have a great Sunday!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
* EXCEMPT s/b spelled EXEMPT! I will go get my REAL caffeine now! :D
(and I didn’t finish the last line) “GET THE REAL CULPRITS, and the unethical people who are illegally playing the judicial system!”
Beth [154] so you were put in Spam and was not offered any coffee? Ken you are slaking
OK I am out for awhile too my Dad & Hubby’s B-Day is Wednesday so I am taking a Carrot cake over to my Mom & Dad’s so both [Hubby & Dad] can celebrate together. Wow my Dad is turning 81 but you would never know it. My Dad always says we [our family] are like a fine wine, we improve with age
Have a Great Day all!
new thread up for y’all
For you coffee lovers, I will share my great recipe with you. For a 10 cup pot: 2/3 measurecolumbian coffee and 1/3 measure New Orleans coffee with chicory. I order my New Orleans coffee directly from the company in La., by the case. One free pound with 6 pounds. Beter than Gevalia!
raven [158] I’m the only one who drinks the chickory around here. rose hates it *chuckles* What kind do you get? Community or Cafe Dumonde?
Ken, the can is labeled French Market. I have used Community. They are both good.
Even my neighbors say my coffee is the best around.
raven [160] I’ve seen that label at the store. The one I asked about (it’s a yellow label and say’s CDM on it) is the one served by the famous Cafe du Monde from the French Quarter. Don’t know if you’ve ever been there, but their beignot (probably the wrong spelling) are great.
Ken #144, I am not posting anywhere but here but I don’t want to mess up my nails and I am not a good typist so
. ask my Rosespeaks friends 
I just got here.
liann [162]
150, JMA, I am wondering why she is slinking to the back because she was all out there and now it seems imo that she does not have the pull with VAS as she thought and things are changing, Remember right after she said she would not be available after Judge Chin said 5 days to release everything and she got all tongue tied?, Well then Rita’s motion to reconsider, To me it is last ditch efforts, And W!lma knows what is going on, ( I don’t ) This is all just my opinion, But she is playing CYA because this will be over soon and will be exposed, Something is rotten in Denmark IMO.
I hope everyone is well. Rose and Ken my deepest thoughts are with you both, I am just pissed that you all have to keep going threw this over and over, All the Bloggers, This is just so unfair!!!!!!!!!!,